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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:08 pm 
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fearless bong wrote:
Well Ward is the best at 168lbs, now to claim the no spot of p4p list he should move up in weight and challenge the best of 175lbs champs. then move to cruiserweight then heavyweight. just like RRJ did.


Roy Royce Jr. The guy who beat Bernard Bopkins.

:mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:03 am 
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assassin21 wrote:
you're looking at this as a big picture.

yes you're correct, manny and floyd's accomplishments surpasses andre ward's if we were to compare their careers AS A WHOLE.

there's no doubt manny's accomplishments in and out of the ring is not even up for debate.

however, the basis of the mythical pound for pound lists are a fighter's CURRENT or RECENT activity and level of opposition.

floyd mayweather = recent fights: marquez, mosley, ortiz, cotto
manny pacquiao = recent fights: clottey, margarito, mosley, marquez, bradley
andre ward = recent fights: kessler, bika, abraham, froch, dawson

kessler, abraham, froch and dawson are ranked in their respective top 1-5 in their divisions.



There you have it....Pac and Floyds recent fights were also against top contenders of their weight division...some are also in the pound for pound list best in the world.....so to say Ward is more impressive lately is arguably...

Andre Ward is good but what he showed is not yet enough to dethrone Pac/Floyd as the number 1 pound4pound best...putting him at the number 1 spot just bcoz he defended his belt against a light heavyweight champ is unfair for fighters who are moving up and down in weight challenging themselves just to get that recognition....


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:01 am 
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As Floyd Mayweather would say, "you don't know **** about boxing!".


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:02 am 
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darren_simion wrote:
fearless bong wrote:
Well Ward is the best at 168lbs, now to claim the no spot of p4p list he should move up in weight and challenge the best of 175lbs champs. then move to cruiserweight then heavyweight. just like RRJ did.


Roy Royce Jr. The guy who beat Bernard Bopkins.

:mrgreen:


Just like the chocolate? Royce? LOL!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:16 am 
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He dominated his opponents by clinching and hugging them.. boring...


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:32 pm 
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krayz211 wrote:
assassin21 wrote:
you're looking at this as a big picture.

yes you're correct, manny and floyd's accomplishments surpasses andre ward's if we were to compare their careers AS A WHOLE.

there's no doubt manny's accomplishments in and out of the ring is not even up for debate.

however, the basis of the mythical pound for pound lists are a fighter's CURRENT or RECENT activity and level of opposition.

floyd mayweather = recent fights: marquez, mosley, ortiz, cotto
manny pacquiao = recent fights: clottey, margarito, mosley, marquez, bradley
andre ward = recent fights: kessler, bika, abraham, froch, dawson

kessler, abraham, froch and dawson are ranked in their respective top 1-5 in their divisions.



There you have it....Pac and Floyds recent fights were also against top contenders of their weight division...some are also in the pound for pound list best in the world.....so to say Ward is more impressive lately is arguably...

Andre Ward is good but what he showed is not yet enough to dethrone Pac/Floyd as the number 1 pound4pound best...putting him at the number 1 spot just bcoz he defended his belt against a light heavyweight champ is unfair for fighters who are moving up and down in weight challenging themselves just to get that recognition....



Big difference. Ward was impressive and no one came close to beating him. Pacquiao's win against Marquez was controversial and Floyd struggled against Cotto. Remember that Manny also officially lost to Bradley and wasn't as scintillating in his last three fights. The quality of Ward's wins against top tier opposition far outstrips Floyd's and Manny's victories. With the exception of that fight against Margarito, Manny also stayed put in the welterweight division.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:25 am 
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Emmanuel53 wrote:
krayz211 wrote:
assassin21 wrote:
you're looking at this as a big picture.

yes you're correct, manny and floyd's accomplishments surpasses andre ward's if we were to compare their careers AS A WHOLE.

there's no doubt manny's accomplishments in and out of the ring is not even up for debate.

however, the basis of the mythical pound for pound lists are a fighter's CURRENT or RECENT activity and level of opposition.

floyd mayweather = recent fights: marquez, mosley, ortiz, cotto
manny pacquiao = recent fights: clottey, margarito, mosley, marquez, bradley
andre ward = recent fights: kessler, bika, abraham, froch, dawson

kessler, abraham, froch and dawson are ranked in their respective top 1-5 in their divisions.




There you have it....Pac and Floyds recent fights were also against top contenders of their weight division...some are also in the pound for pound list best in the world.....so to say Ward is more impressive lately is arguably...

Andre Ward is good but what he showed is not yet enough to dethrone Pac/Floyd as the number 1 pound4pound best...putting him at the number 1 spot just bcoz he defended his belt against a light heavyweight champ is unfair for fighters who are moving up and down in weight challenging themselves just to get that recognition....



Big difference. Ward was impressive and no one came close to beating him. Pacquiao's win against Marquez was controversial and Floyd struggled against Cotto. Remember that Manny also officially lost to Bradley and wasn't as scintillating in his last three fights. The quality of Ward's wins against top tier opposition far outstrips Floyd's and Manny's victories. With the exception of that fight against Margarito, Manny also stayed put in the welterweight division.


completely agree with this. pound for pound rankings change every now and again. pacfans, it's OKAY that andre ward gets top spot right now. regardless of how much pacfans defend manny's claim (or even mayweather's) to the pound for pound throne, andre ward looked impressive and made it look EASY beating out the top guys in his division. manny and floyd, failed to impress on their last few outings.

and in regards to manny and floyd fighting top opposition in their divisions. sorry, but not really. manny fought at welterweight, bradley coming from junior welterweight, marquez coming from lightweight, not at all established at welter. clottey, though a welterweight is probably top 10 but not within top 5, margarito though an exciting fight, has not fought since his loss to mosley, and mosley, well, just aged too much and hung around long enough to survive against manny.

floyd struggled against cotto, sucker punched ortiz, manhandled marquez whom first stepped into welterweight coming from lightweight, and mosley, well, just aged again too much and hung around to cash in on floyd. hardly top division contenders.

ward on the other hand fought mikkel kessler when he was a fellow super middleweight champion, fought froch for the super six finals title and for the wba/wbc unification title fight, abraham when he was the most feared super middleweight and technically still undefeated (despite that dq from the dirrell fight), and chad dawson ranked as the number 1 light heavyweight and champion at this time, and ward won handily by decision/knockout and made these guys seem like not top 5 in their division. made it look EASY.

again, pound for pound rankings changes all the time and different from person to person, who knows manny might take number 1 again if he destroys marquez/bradley, or floyd fight someone significant, but as of right NOW, you can't deny ward is the man, the pound for pound king. RING has him ranked number 3, manny at 2 and floyd at 1 which is completely ok, but a lot of people regard him now as the number 1 coz any hardcore boxing fan knows how powerful the guys he fought recently were.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:31 am 
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so who is Gil P. Acosta, anyway?

why did he abandon ship? :biglaugh:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:24 am 
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andre ward is the same as other boxers, who risks their lives in making money for their family, vices, and babes...

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:52 am 
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freewheeze wrote:
so who is Gil P. Acosta, anyway?

why did he abandon ship? :biglaugh:


LOL, he never came back. the boxing fans ate him up with facts hahaha


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:17 pm 
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freewheeze wrote:
pacland (boxing forum) is really dead. :(




:mrgreen:




yeah, to think that this is posted on the wrong forum category and the topic itself is as stupid as the TS itself...

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Tanong lang baklitang radeona, nasa WORLD CUP na ba yung mga fafa mo?

Ay eto pa, nasa ASIAN CUP na ba yung mga fafa mo?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:03 pm 
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freewheeze wrote:
Gil P. Acosta wrote:
Andre Ward, who? Who has he beaten? He beat Dawson, really? And who is Dawson anyway? Ward has not shown anything remarkable. Maybe he looked good in his last fight but who did he beat? The man he beat is not even rated in the 10 pound for pound best. And particularly they fought in their own confortable weights. What is remarkable about that? Maybe it could be a spectacular win to some but as I have commented against who? One is judged by the opposition one beats. Winning in spectacular fashion against someone who is not even spectacular is meaningless. Do not compare apples and oranges. A boxer is considered pound for pound best if he has proven that he can win even at weights uncomfortable with him and that will make a win more meaningful. The class of opposition say a lot on a boxer's win record. Beating Dawson is just ordinary, OK?



wth :lol:

as if the dawson win is only ward's claim to fame.




andre ward won the super six super middleweight tournament.

he has beaten every super middle available.

notable fights

edison miranda-
mikkel kessler -
allan green - -
sakio bika -
arthur abraham
carl froch
chad dawson


titles: WBA, WBC, RING supermiddleweight



now if you have no idea what is the super six or who are these fighters, then you should follow a different sport.

try figure skating.
:carnival:



you just informed him because he knows nothing... :lol:

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Ang tanong na hindi masagot ni baklitang RADEONA:

Tanong lang baklitang radeona, nasa WORLD CUP na ba yung mga fafa mo?

Ay eto pa, nasa ASIAN CUP na ba yung mga fafa mo?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:22 pm 
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assassin21 wrote:
manny's wars against morales, barrera, marquez, etc are irrelevant if we were to look at the current pound for pound lists, so is mayweather's wars against castillo, corrales and gatti. if you looked at their careers as a an entire whole, then you can certainly debate that floyd and manny are above andre ward. but pound for pound rankings as mythical as they are change every month and vary from fan to fan and journalist to journalist, so fans need to understand it's completely OK for andre ward to be claimed as number 1, RIGHT NOW. as in CURRENTLY. on top of being undefeated, fought top 5 opposition in his division, is VERY hard to dispute.

can;'t look at this as a pacfan, coz regardless of the facts presented to some paclanders, they'll always put manny AHEAD of anybody regardless of that particular fighter's accompishments.


Those fights of manny with other future hall of famers are still relevant because if the previous accomplishments of a fighter is not considered in p4p ranking then floyd should had been ranked lower or even beyond top ten since he only fights once in a while, and his last few fights were not as dominating as compared to his fights against gatti and corrales.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:19 pm 
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xpact123 wrote:
assassin21 wrote:
manny's wars against morales, barrera, marquez, etc are irrelevant if we were to look at the current pound for pound lists, so is mayweather's wars against castillo, corrales and gatti. if you looked at their careers as a an entire whole, then you can certainly debate that floyd and manny are above andre ward. but pound for pound rankings as mythical as they are change every month and vary from fan to fan and journalist to journalist, so fans need to understand it's completely OK for andre ward to be claimed as number 1, RIGHT NOW. as in CURRENTLY. on top of being undefeated, fought top 5 opposition in his division, is VERY hard to dispute.

can;'t look at this as a pacfan, coz regardless of the facts presented to some paclanders, they'll always put manny AHEAD of anybody regardless of that particular fighter's accompishments.


Those fights of manny with other future hall of famers are still relevant because if the previous accomplishments of a fighter is not considered in p4p ranking then floyd should had been ranked lower or even beyond top ten since he only fights once in a while, and his last few fights were not as dominating as compared to his fights against gatti and corrales.



Not really. Why do you think the Pound for Pound ratings are changed every so often? The Recent Accomplishments of fighters carry a heavier weight than their previous ones although in certain cases, recent history remains a factor but it doesn't go that far back as what you're trying to imply. http://www.philstar.com/SportsArticle.a ... eId=748766
Floyd still remains undefeated and still remains active in the ring despite his very limited apperances. Manny's victories against those Future Hall of Famers are a
significant factor in judging his place in the All Time Greats ranking.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:46 am 
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This is further proof that Pactards only know about Manny Pacquiao and CLUELESS about any other boxer.


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