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 Post subject: FACT-CHECKING THE BIBLE
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2014 5:42 pm 
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I am re-printing this article by R. Lorenzi regarding the stories and some 'facts'
about the bible that may have some believers of this holy book to seriously think
and re-assessed the pre-programmed beliefs of some stories contained in it.

There is no intent to malign nor insult the believers about their holy book but merely
to point out some historical facts in the stories that are clearly not historically viable.


Fact-Checking the Bible -
APR 19, 2014 07:00 AM ET // BY ROSSELLA LORENZI

Image
Gutenberg Bible of the New York Public Library. NYC WANDERER (KEVIN ENG)/WIKIMEDIA COMMONS

Is the Bible Fact or Fiction?

The question has been debated for centuries by archaeologists, religious scholars and historians.
So far, no definitive answer has been given. Science and archaeological discoveries have supported
the Bible in some instances while refuting many of its most popular tales.

Read on to discover some of the more contentious issues in the Bible that may or may not stand up
to historic and scientific scrutiny.

Next - GALLERY: Noah's Ark in Its Many Forms:

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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2014 10:51 pm 
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When somebody tried to make proclamations about the physical universe based on the Bible passages, got the wrong answer.

Neil Tyson

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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 10:27 am 
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Camels in the Bible :

Image
Abraham's Journey from Ur to Canaan, József Molnár, 1850. WIKIMEDIA COMMONS

Camels play a central role in Genesis and are mentioned as pack animals in the biblical stories of Abraham, Joseph and Jacob.
But according to newly published research by Tel Aviv University based on radiocarbon dating and evidence unearthed in excavations,
camels were not domesticated in the Land of Israel until the 10th century BC -- several centuries after the time
they appear in the Bible.

"In addition to challenging the Bible's historicity, this anachronism is direct proof that the text was compiled well after the
events it describes,"
the university said in a statement.

However, several scholars believe the study, by archaeologists Erez Ben-Yosef and Lidar Sapir-Hen, adds little to our knowledge.

"We have known about this camel anachronism for over a century now from site analysis.
The Hebrews were donkey people hugging the coastlines and water routes, not camel people
," Robert Eisenman, professor
of Middle East religions, archaeology, and Islamic law and director of the Institute for the Study of Judaeo-Christian Origins at California State University Long Beach,
told Discovery News.

Eisenman contends that many of these materials are based on oral tradition.

"So, though they might have been put into writing later, that doesn't mean they were not originally created much earlier,” he said.

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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 10:45 am 
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Do camels prove that the Bible is inaccurate? Archaeologists reveal mammals were domesticated in 900BC -
centuries after Biblical characters rode them. Archaeologists from the University of Tel Aviv, Israel, found that
camels were not domesticated in Israel until the 9th century BC


They claim this shows that Biblical text was compiled long after the events described in it and challenges the Bible
as a historical document

Researchers analysed the oldest known domesticated camel bones, found in the Aravah Valley in the southern Levant,
to inform their research.

By SARAH GRIFFITHS
PUBLISHED: 13:29 GMT, 4 February 2014 | UPDATED: 17:01 GMT, 4 February 2014

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... z31twafHO7

(emphasis mine)

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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 11:31 am 
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zorro05 wrote:
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Camels in the Bible :

Image
Abraham's Journey from Ur to Canaan, József Molnár, 1850. WIKIMEDIA COMMONS

Camels play a central role in Genesis and are mentioned as pack animals in the biblical stories of Abraham, Joseph and Jacob.
But according to newly published research by Tel Aviv University based on radiocarbon dating and evidence unearthed in excavations,
camels were not domesticated in the Land of Israel until the 10th century BC -- several centuries after the time
they appear in the Bible.

"In addition to challenging the Bible's historicity, this anachronism is direct proof that the text was compiled well after the
events it describes,"
the university said in a statement.

However, several scholars believe the study, by archaeologists Erez Ben-Yosef and Lidar Sapir-Hen, adds little to our knowledge.

"We have known about this camel anachronism for over a century now from site analysis.
The Hebrews were donkey people hugging the coastlines and water routes, not camel people
," Robert Eisenman, professor
of Middle East religions, archaeology, and Islamic law and director of the Institute for the Study of Judaeo-Christian Origins at California State University Long Beach,
told Discovery News.

Eisenman contends that many of these materials are based on oral tradition.

"So, though they might have been put into writing later, that doesn't mean they were not originally created much earlier,” he said.


Ogag na obob pa. Alam mo ba kung saan ang Ur? :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 11:34 am 
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Nyahahahahaha! Sirit si Zurrot. :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 11:35 am 
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nalingat na naman ang mga nurse, nakawala na naman si jjcross :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 11:38 am 
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gambol wrote:
nalingat na naman ang mga nurse, nakawala na naman si jjcross :lol:



Nyahahahaha!!! :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 4:19 pm 
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gambol wrote:
nalingat na naman ang mga nurse, nakawala na naman si jjcross :lol:


`
lol...

me kasabihan tayu na...,

'..ang pumatol sa mga me diperensya...., ay....'


:D

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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 9:04 pm 
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zorro05 wrote:
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Camels in the Bible :

Image
Abraham's Journey from Ur to Canaan, József Molnár, 1850. WIKIMEDIA COMMONS



..the title of this painting by József Molnárpic is "Abrahams Departure" AND NOT journey from ur to canaan..indeed ur have camels..

..Ur's (ancient mesopotamia - modern day iraq , near the mouth of the euphrates on the persian gulf) "agriculture throughout the region has been supplemented by nomadic pastoralism, where tent-dwelling nomads herded sheep and goats (and later camels) from the river pastures in the dry summer months, out into seasonal grazing lands on the desert fringe in the wet winter season."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesopotamia

..the bible did not say that canaan have camels..the bible said that abraham came from mesopotamia and he did have camels...

Quote:
Two archaeologists at Tel Aviv University, Erez Ben-Yosef and Lidar Sapir-Hen, claimed earlier this month they have dated the earliest domesticated camels to the end of the 10th century BC. "In addition to challenging the Bible's historicity, this anachronism is direct proof that the text was compiled well after the events it describes," the university said in a statement.

Steinmann agrees there's no archaeological evidence for widespread use of camels in Palestine at this time, but adds that that's not what the Bible is saying.

Amy Hall, a staff with the Christian group Stand to Reason, has transcribed the professor's interview on her blog.

"What it is showing is that somebody who originally came from Mesopotamia, like Abraham, he did have some camels," she quotes the professor as saying.
http://www.christianpost.com/news/camel ... gs-114678/


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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 9:46 am 
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@kainTT

Abraham did depart from Ur in Mesopotamia to Canaan, the so-called promise land
according to the biblical story. It is not the painting or its title that is of issue here,
but, the act or reference to Abrams journey.

Yes, Canaan as well as most of the middle east we call now, in ancient times did have many
animals in their daily nomadic life including camels.

But not during the times the bible stories said it, not even in Abrams time. Only in much
later period of time did camels were domesticated.

Archaeological proof and /or reference to such claims must be viable to conclusively
show that biblical stories are indeed historically plausible.

Yes of course, when you say the bible said that Abrams had camels. It is inerrant, right ?

The bible also tells many other interesting, fascinating stories about animals talking,
the parting of the Red Sea, big fish swallowing people, etc...


But are the stories historically, archaeologically correct ?

:)

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 10:29 am 
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zorro05 wrote:
`
@kainTT

Abraham did depart from Ur in Mesopotamia to Canaan, the so-called promise land
according to the biblical story. It is not the painting or its title that is of issue here,
but, the act or reference to Abrams journey.

Yes, Canaan as well as most of the middle east we call now, in ancient times did have many
animals in their daily nomadic life including camels.

But not during the times the bible stories said it, not even in Abrams time. Only in much
later period of time did camels were domesticated.

Archaeological proof and /or reference to such claims must be viable to conclusively
show that biblical stories are indeed historically plausible.

Yes of course, when you say the bible said that Abrams had camels. It is inerrant, right ?

The bible also tells many other interesting, fascinating stories about animals talking,
the parting of the Red Sea, big fish swallowing people, etc...


But are the stories historically, archaeologically correct ?

:)


Recent discoveries, however, have shown that this dismissal is unwarranted. Excavations in eastern Arabia, an area once believed to be a cultural backwater unworthy of archaeological investigation, have turned up evidence that camels were first domesticated by Semites before the time of Abraham. Much of this evidence has been examined by M. C. A. MacDonald of the Oriental Faculty at the University of Oxford and an epigraphist specializing in ancient North Arabian and Aramaic inscriptions. He wrote:

Recent research has suggested that domestication of the camel took place in southeastern Arabia some time in the third millennium [BC]. Originally, it was probably bred for its milk, hair, leather, and meat, but it cannot have been long before its usefulness as a beast of burden became apparent (1995: 1357).

With this third millennium date for camel domestication in mind, let us look at the approximate date of the Patriarchal era. According to Exodus 12:40, the Israelites dwelt in Egypt for 430 years; according to 1 Kings 6:1, the Temple of Solomon was built 480 years after the flight from Egypt. Since most archaeologists date the construction of the Temple to the tenth century BC, simple arithmetic brings us back to the period of the 19th or 18th centuries BC, well after the first domestication of the camel. When we juxtapose the Biblical date for the Patriarchs with MacDonald’s date for the earliest camel domestication, the claim of anachronism evaporates.

Image
A Ninth century BC relief from Tell Halaf, Syria, showing a man riding a camel. Development of the behind-the-hump saddle (see Gn 31:34) bolstered use of the camel for travel as well as for transport.


There is an additional point raised by these recent findings. A map accompanying MacDonald’s article pointed out that the principle area of extensive early camel domestication was the Syro-Arabian desert, due west of Ur, Abraham’s birthplace (1995: 1356). Additionally, MacDonald noted that Semitic pre-Patriarchal domestication of camels near Ur eventually made possible direct traffic between major centers of civilization and trade across regions previously regarded as impassable. The inhabitants of the Syro-Arabian desert thus held the key to the crossing of these regions, giving them a commercial and strategic value to surrounding rulers that was out of proportion to their economic and military strength (MacDonald 1995: 1357).

One-humped dromedary camel. While both one-humped dromedary camels and two-humped bactrian camels are known in the ancient Near East, the dromedary was the most prominent. W. F. Albright concluded that the camel could not have been domesticated before the end of the 12th century BC, yet the Bible dates the domesticated camel to the days of Abraham (ca. 2000 BC). Scholars are undecided whether camels were first bred for their milk, hair, leather and meat, or for use as a beast of burden. The author suggests use of the domesticated camel for travel and transport as a major factor in the wealth the Bible attributed to the patriarchs Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

According to MacDonald, the newly domesticated camel was used to traverse rough inhospitable terrain such as that between Mesopotamia, where Abraham was born, and Canaan, where he and his offspring eventually settled. This, of course, is in keeping with the frequent mention of camels in the Biblical story of three individuals who expended considerable effort traveling between Mesopotamia and the Levant (e.g., Gn 12:4–5; 24:10ff; 28:2–5).

http://www.biblearchaeology.org/post/20 ... px#Article

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 11:42 am 
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The bible is fiction: A collection of evidence



The similarities between the stories and characters in the Bible and those from previous mythologies are both undeniable and well-documented. It is only due to extreme the extreme religious bias that pervades our world today that people rarely get exposed to this information.

In this short piece I’ll attempt to show blatant similarities with regard to two of the most important Biblical narratives: the Genesis story and the character of Jesus Christ.

The Book of Genesis’s Flood Story Mirrors The Epic Of Gilgamesh From Hundreds Of Years Earlier

Here are a number of elements that both Gilgamesh and the flood story in Genesis share:
1.God decided to send a worldwide flood. This would drown men, women, children, babies and infants, as well as eliminate all of the land animals and birds.
2.God knew of one righteous man, Ut-Napishtim or Noah.
3.God ordered the hero to build a multi-story wooden ark (called a chest or box in the original Hebrew), and the hero initially complained about the assignment to build the boat.
4.The arc would have many compartments, a single door, be sealed with pitch and would house one of every animal species.
5.A great rain covered the land with water.
6.The arc landed on a mountain in the Middle East.
7.The first two birds returned to the ark. The third bird apparently found dry land because it did not return.
8.The hero and his family left the ark, ritually killed an animal, offered it as a sacrifice.
9.The Babylonian gods seemed genuinely sorry for the genocide that they had created. The God of Noah appears to have regretted his actions as well, because he promised never to do it again.

Keep in mind the level of detail in these similarities. It’s not a matter of just a flood, but specific details: three birds sent out, resisting the call to build the arc, and a single man being chosen by God to build the arc.

Then consider that the first story (Gilgamesh) came from Babylon — hundreds of years before the Bible was even written. Do you honestly think, based on the similarities above, that those who wrote the Genesis story had not heard the Gilgamesh story?

And if they had heard it, and they were simply rehashing an old, very popular tale, what does that say about the Bible?

Jesus’s Story Is An Obvious Rehashing Of Numerous Previous Characters

Perhaps even more compelling is the story of Christ himself. As it turns out it’s not even remotely original. It is instead nothing more than a collection of bits and pieces from dozens of other stories that came long before. Here are some examples.
1.Asklepios healed the sick, raised the dead, and was known as the savior and redeemer.
2.Hercules was born of a divine father and mortal mother and was known as the savior of the world. Prophets foretold his birth and claimed he would be a king, which started a search by a leader who wanted to kill him. He walked on water and told his mother, “Don’t cry, I’m going to heaven.” when he died. As he passed he said, “It is finished.“
3.Dionysus was literally the “Son of God”, was born of a virgin mother, and was commonly depicted riding a donkey. He healed the sick and turned water to wine. He was killed but was resurrected and became immortal. His greatest accomplishment was his own death, which delivers humanity itself.
4.Osiris did the same things. He was born of a virgin, was considered the first true king of the people, and when he died he rose from the grave and went to heaven.
5.Osiris’s son, Horus, was known as the “light of the world”, “The good shepherd”, and “the lamb”. He was also referred to as, “The way, the truth, and the life.” His symbol was a cross.
6.Mithra‘s birthday was celebrated on the 25th of December, his birth was witnessed by local shepherds who brought him gifts, had 12 disciples, and when he was done on earth he had a final meal before going up to heaven. On judgment day he’ll return to pass judgment on the living and the dead. The good will go to heaven, and the evil will die in a giant fire. His holiday is on Sunday (he’s the Sun God). His followers called themselves “brothers”, and their leaders “fathers”. They had baptism and a meal ritual where symbolic flesh and blood were eaten. Heaven was in the sky, and hell was below with demons and sinners.
7.Krishna had a miraculous conception that wise men were able to come to because they were guided by a star. After he was born an area ruler tried to have him found and killed. His parents were warned by a divine messenger, however, and they escaped and was met by shepherds. The boy grew up to be the mediator between God and man.
8.Buddha‘s mother was told by an angel that she’d give birth to a holy child destined to be a savior. As a child he teaches the priests in his temple about religion while his parents look for him. He starts his religious career at roughly 30 years of age and is said to have spoken to 12 disciples on his deathbed. One of the disciples is his favorite, and another is a traitor. He and his disciples abstain from wealth and travel around speaking in parables and metaphors. He called himself “the son of man” and was referred to as, “prophet”, “master”, and “Lord”. He healed the sick, cured the blind and deaf, and he walked on water. One of his disciples tried to walk on water as well but sunk because his faith wasn’t strong enough.
9.Apollonius of Tyana (a contemporary of Jesus) performed countless miracles (healing sick and crippled, restored sight, casted out demons, etc.) His birth was of a virgin, foretold by an angel. He knew scripture really well as a child. He was crucified, rose from the dead and appeared to his disciples to prove his power before going to heaven to sit at the right hand of the father. He was known as, “The Son of God”.

The problem, of course, is that these previous narratives existed hundreds to thousands of years before Jesus did.


http://www.danielmiessler.com/blog/the- ... f-evidence


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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 1:50 pm 
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zorro05 wrote:
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@kainTT


:)

:shock: :shock: :shock:


..very well, continue believing in the legend of the fox then..leave the dromedary alone..


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 9:42 am 
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