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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:12 pm 
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Dan Rightcross wrote:
Look closely at the shoulder roll. If two right handed boxers take a conventional stance both will have a lead left foot. The one executing the shoulder roll will use his right hand to block the left specially left hooks. His left shoulder will cover his chin so that the right hooks of the opponent could not get through.

When fighting a left handed boxer, the shoulder roll will not work as well. The leftie will just keep turning counterclockwise. This will create an opening at for both a left straight and right jabs or even right hooks. This is the reason why Mayweather has been ducking Pacquiao. Pacquaio's left handed boxing stance would make it extremely difficult to execute the shoulder roll defense.


watch Floyd vs Corley.. yes, Corley had some success when Floyd did the Philly shell.. but that fight also proved that Floyd can actually fight some other way... Floyd's really good at shoulder roll that most people tend to neglect the other skills that he has especially on offense...

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:16 pm 
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devondenom wrote:
There's nothing like it. The "Shoulder Roll" popularized by Floyd is the best defensive and offensive technique in boxing today. Mastering it would make one's fighter prolong their career preventing too much accumulation of punches while confidently landing landing your punches to the opponent. I could not help but be impressed with this technique watching adrian bronner while annihilating de Marco with a twist of aggression. His Floyd-like skills really made him another boxing star protege. For now, I firmly believe that there's no "blue print" yet in penetrating the defense of this unique and innovative technique.

Boxers who wants to be successful in boxing, open your eyes... It's the best technique that you need to master.







gayish style.... :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:18 pm 
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shoulder roll should be equiped with speed and a lot of speed or else its not as effective as it is.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:24 pm 
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effective only for a short necked boxer...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:39 pm 
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Here perhaps is the answer in solving the shoulder roll.

This may be long but it's worth reading with all the necessary images.

Enjoy!

http://www.thesweetscience.com/news/art ... e-problemq


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:45 pm 
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devondenom wrote:
onelenz wrote:
... the reason why FMJ ducks Pacman.


With all due respect, based from realistic point of view. The issue of the fight not being made between Floyd and Manny is not about Floyd ducking Manny Pacquiao or vice versa. It's about the terms of the fight. Both fighters' demands are conflicting. It's about pride and getting the biggest share of the pie add Bob Arum to the mix and it became a complex negotiation. If Manny gives in to the 45-55 term then Floyd wins the psychological and monetary war which provides him a 95% of winning chance.

In my own personal opinion this fight should not happen. Floyd is right, Manny is way out of his level considering the weight, experience and skills. Manny is biting more than he can chew if he made this fight happen for he is not a natural welterweight. Floyd should be fighting the likes of Martinez or Andre Ward. But I understand him... he lives with his monicker "Money" and at his age and status he has the right pick up fights where PPV counts. For Manny, he should be contented of the legacy he already established. There's no need for him to take dangerous fight that would hurt his legacy, I would suggest for him to retire right away after his 4th bout with Marquez... WIN or LOOSE.


your just scraping the surface if you think the terms of the fight and money are the real issues. FMJ ducking Pac because Pac has the style that can give him his first loss. I agree with you that Manny's legacy has been established. You cannot say that to FMJ. there's always a question mark on his legacy by not fighting pac


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:49 pm 
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You need fast hands for the shoulder roll to be effective.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:31 pm 
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master the "dont-party-too-much", "follow-the-game-plan", "build-stamina", "focus-focus-focus", "scout-your-opponent-well", "defend-yourself-at-all-times", "perfect-timing", "avoid-distractions" techniques first and you'll never need shoulder rolls anymore and besides you'll never be called a chicken for life.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:30 pm 
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Most Pinoy fighters will never do that.
They will just take the Shanghai Roll instead. :mrgreen:

Image


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:35 pm 
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onelenz wrote:
your just scraping the surface if you think the terms of the fight and money are the real issues. FMJ ducking Pac because Pac has the style that can give him his first loss. I agree with you that Manny's legacy has been established. You cannot say that to FMJ. there's always a question mark on his legacy by not fighting pac


And so with Pacquiao who is bombarded by the controversial result of the last two encounter with Marquez which most believe that Marquez won. Fear is not also an issue for both fighters because they would never reach their status just to fear another fighter. In annihilating Morales, de la hoya, cotto and mosley there are always logical reason for these fallen fighters to be dominated because of deprivation of nutrition and weight issues. Floyd fought these fighters at there best weight and perhaps at their peek. Pacquiao might have the style to beat Floyd but for most aspects Pacquiao would be totally dominated, the weight alone is one big factor.

I'm saying this not because I prefer Floyd over Pac. I just admire Floyd's talent and skills not his personality. But if the fight happens of course I would root on Manny for I'm a Filipino but my mind would always favor Floyd because of the above-mentioned facts. Perhaps lets discuss on fighters advantage on the following aspects to really find out who got the realistic advantage:

A. Experience - MANNY. I can say that Manny got a little advantage on this based from the number of fights.
B. Weight - FLOYD. Obviously Floyd would be heavier and packs more power than Manny for he's a regular welterweight.
C. Skills - FLOYD. C'mon... Floyd is way too fast, too quick, too talented, and too smart than Manny (of course on the welterweight division).
D. Offense - MANNY. Well, I say Pacquiao got the slight advantage but question is: Can he land those punches in bunches?
E. Defense - FLOYD. No doubt, Floyd. He's a defense and counterpunch specialist. If Manny could not handle Marquez' counterpunch how much more with Floyd who toyed with Marquez.
F. Reach - Manny's 68 cm reach against Floyd's 71. Advantage: FLOYD
G. Focus - FLOYD. The multitasking Manny with politics is a big let down. He's new found faith is not much of a help. Floyd's domestic violence won't affect him at all, he's used to it. Though ODD but his cockiness, pride, and practicallity helps him a lot in Psychological aspect, not to mention his motivation on MONEY. The advantage is still on Floyd
H. Height - FLOYD
I. Power - FLOYD. A definite match in welterweight limit FLOYD packs more power while Manny needs to land more to get the KO.
J. Quality of Opponents - FLOYD. FMJ fought most credible fighters on their convenient weight and on their prime. In Manny's case he fought them deprived of good nutrion and condition.
K. Level of Decline - FLOYD. The last four fights of Manny reveals he's decline. Not much with Floyd.

So there you go FMJ-9 MP-2. Those are my realistic and logical basis.You may suggest any other logical aspects... Bring it on.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:47 pm 
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devondenom wrote:
There's nothing like it. The "Shoulder Roll" popularized by Floyd is the best defensive and offensive technique in boxing today. Mastering it would make one's fighter prolong their career preventing too much accumulation of punches while confidently landing landing your punches to the opponent. I could not help but be impressed with this technique watching adrian bronner while annihilating de Marco with a twist of aggression. His Floyd-like skills really made him another boxing star protege. For now, I firmly believe that there's no "blue print" yet in penetrating the defense of this unique and innovative technique.

Boxers who wants to be successful in boxing, open your eyes... It's the best technique that you need to master.


Wrong. the "shell" aka "philly shell" aka "shoulder roll" is the most difficult defensive technique to master. there are a lot of risks that you take when you utilize this technique. also, you have to be fast, have quick reflexes, great timing, great footwork, understand counter punching, and countless hours of practice.
you dont just pick up this skill with ease, you train to master it for years.

Yes its very impressive because it seems effortless to pull (this is also my favorite defense to use to set up counter punches. im not a master at it.)

it has its ups and downs. you cant fully rely on it (unless youre Floyd Mayweather) when you're getting swarmed by punches because you will eat tons of leather.

you cant properly protect yourself against body punches at times.

you'd be a sucker for a jab if you're slower than your opponent.

it exposes your chin if you're slower and your timing sucks.

the shoulder roll is a great way to set up right hand counters and short left hooks/uppercuts.

only way you can pull this technique off is if you have tons of experience, focus, and practice.

the best defensive style is the one you're most comfortable with.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:50 pm 
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namme wrote:
Here perhaps is the answer in solving the shoulder roll.

This may be long but it's worth reading with all the necessary images.

Enjoy!

http://www.thesweetscience.com/news/art ... e-problemq


Thanks for sharing this Namme. It must be the best explanation I've seen so far on how the shoulder roll is used and how it can be nullified. If ever the Pacquiao vs Mayweather fight happens this is what we will see in the fight. Mayweather trying to use it and Pacquiao making it seem useless. Just the shiftiness of Pacquiao would give Mayweather fits. Not to mention the punches in bunches. Floyd will end up staring at the ceiling and looking at the bright lights while he's down in the canvass.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:57 pm 
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tHeJoKeR wrote:
gayish style.... :lol:


Call it any name you want... at the end of it all it's not the one who masters it getting beat up.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:04 pm 
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Of course, "shoulder roll" is good with PED sauce. :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:52 pm 
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Imagine TS if by chance a genie will grant your wish and all upcoming boxers will have the shoulder roll defense. :lol: :lol: :lol:


I think I will prefer to watch cha cha or rumba than watching two boxer doing the shoulder roll for 12 rounds. :lol: :lol:

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