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Who is the greatest mexican boxer?
http://forum.philboxing.com/viewtopic.php?f=98&t=111879
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Author:  grayfist [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Austin348 wrote:
Oh, that complaint...

I guess I shall be in line for putting my nephews, nieces and their children to similar tasks in a couple of decades or so. :lol: My wife and I have not been blessed with children... :(

As for ODLH-Pacquiao...Honestly, I still cannot make up my mind. I'm sorry bud. There are days when I fear for Pacquiao, and then, there are days when I can't dismiss his chances.

Maybe as the fight date draws nearer... :)


I wanna believe that Manny has a chance, and I'll be rooting for him whole heartedly, but I have a difficult time beliveing he can beat Oscar. "Wear him out for a late round stoppage" and the old "puncher's chance" addage gets hard to believe when guys like Fernando and Felix couldn't hit him hard enough to stop him.[/quote]

Yes, all those considerations that you cited and a few more, such as noting that Vargas was 6 years ago and Trinidad was some 9 years ago. And, then, there's the question of how much is compromised by Oscar's having to go down to the required weight and where that compromise is going to be, if there be any. If it's in the torso, then it can be trouble for Oscar.

And there are questions re Pacquiao as well, among them, how quick can he still be at a weight that is 12 lbs. heavier than the last time he fought? How much speed can he retain in his punches? His power, after all, mostly comes from that speed.

Many, many more questions.

I'm just asking myself too many questions that I cannot arrive at a definite conclusion. That's where I am at the moment. I dunno if I can move towards leaping into one side or the other at fight time. Maybe not.

Maybe, I'll just watch the fight on neutral. That may be a little less fun, but just a little. :D

Author:  THE MEXICAN [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Austin348 wrote:
THE MEXICAN wrote:
Austin348 wrote:

I wanna believe that Manny has a chance, and I'll be rooting for him whole heartedly, but I have a difficult time beliveing he can beat Oscar. "Wear him out for a late round stoppage" and the old "puncher's chance" addage gets hard to believe when guys like Fernando and Felix couldn't hit him hard enough to stop him.


youre seeing the light, go preach all over pacland, repent nuthuggers! :biglaugh:

Of course maybe he'll tap him in the side and have him rolling around like Bernard did. :lol: X


so you really believed he was koed by that hook? lol, oscar dropped to the ground and faked he was hurt, he knew he was gonna get ktfoed later on in that round or the next, he faked it, you know it look not as bad to be koed by a hook to the liver than ktfoed senseless to the head, just like johnny gonzalez vs gerry, i jumped in my living room and said bullshyt! some boxing writers called it the phantom punch to this day....

Author:  waterbase67 [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

zorro! :batman:

Author:  grayfist [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

THE MEXICAN wrote:

i understand, you dont want to be jumped by nuthuggers ;) hahaha
hey, im excited with both main tv outfits in mexico showing boxing again, starting in late 80s and early 90s boxing turned into ppv and boxing lost even more fans to soccer, i think we are to see a revival in the next years, what you think of mares and victor ortiz? i think theyll be kicking *** pretty soon....

:lol: I've had the experience of having been in the crosshairs of ALA boxing fans some time back, and I emerged from that one rather well. But I have not had been the prey of Pacfans. Having seen what they can do to websites, no less, I won't beg for it. God forbid that I do it to myself! :lol:

Vicious Victor is already kicking some good ***, as I see it, pal. The first round stoppage of Mausa was beyond words! And that came after his having viciously clobbered Emmanuel Clotey.

His only loss should have been a win. The Alarcon fight was shamefully officiated, I think, and Alarcon himself was just as big a shame.

Along with Ortiz, Abner Mares is also one I'd like to see more of. I realize he does not pack as much power as many others but when his name is mentioned I can't help but visualize his short work of Gabi.

I was among those who were unsettled when they made boxing PPV in Mexico, so I'm so gladdened by your news! :D

Note: sorry for the delays in my responses, bud. This economic s___ that hit the fan is having me doing many things at the same time. :( But by no means am I going to miss coming in and out of Pacland as much as I can. :D

Author:  jowee [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

None of the above.
But here's my top 3.
1. Julio Ceasar Chavez, Sr.
2. Ricardo 'El Finito' Lopez
3. Salvador Sanchez

Author:  THE MEXICAN [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

grayfist wrote:
THE MEXICAN wrote:

i understand, you dont want to be jumped by nuthuggers ;) hahaha
hey, im excited with both main tv outfits in mexico showing boxing again, starting in late 80s and early 90s boxing turned into ppv and boxing lost even more fans to soccer, i think we are to see a revival in the next years, what you think of mares and victor ortiz? i think theyll be kicking *** pretty soon....

:lol: I've had the experience of having been in the crosshairs of ALA boxing fans some time back, and I emerged from that one rather well. But I have not had been the prey of Pacfans. Having seen what they can do to websites, no less, I won't beg for it. God forbid that I do it to myself! :lol:

Vicious Victor is already kicking some good ***, as I see it, pal. The first round stoppage of Mausa was beyond words! And that came after his having viciously clobbered Emmanuel Clotey.

His only loss should have been a win. The Alarcon fight was shamefully officiated, I think, and Alarcon himself was just as big a shame.

Along with Ortiz, Abner Mares is also one I'd like to see more of. I realize he does not pack as much power as many others but when his name is mentioned I can't help but visualize his short work of Gabi.

I was among those who were unsettled when they made boxing PPV in Mexico, so I'm so gladdened by your news! :D

Note: sorry for the delays in my responses, bud. This economic s___ that hit the fan is having me doing many things at the same time. :(
mares had detached retina surgery, i think he can easily stay out of circulation for a year, that some serious shyt bro, it almost retired SRL, i have high hopes on ortiz, too bad hes a shortie, i d love to see him clean his and the next division, lets see what happens, time to hit the hay bro, its 2:40 am over here in texas, i hear you on the crisis, myself could end up selling tamales in the streets if the freakin' construction gets no jumpstart from the govt in the next 4 months, canada looks brighter everytime i think about it, ****, even trapping king crabs in alaska or contractor work in iraq :biglaugh:

Author:  Austin348 [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

jowee wrote:
None of the above.
But here's my top 3.
1. Julio Ceasar Chavez, Sr.
2. Ricardo 'El Finito' Lopez
3. Salvador Sanchez

In that order?

Author:  Joe Black [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Prancman wrote:
Juan Manuel Marquez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Eric Morales
Jose Julio Chavez Sr.
Oscar Larios
Jorge Solis
Rafael Marquez


is Jorge Solis a champ?

why Salvador Sánchez is not in the list?

Author:  grayfist [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

THE MEXICAN wrote:
grayfist wrote:
THE MEXICAN wrote:

i understand, you dont want to be jumped by nuthuggers ;) hahaha
hey, im excited with both main tv outfits in mexico showing boxing again, starting in late 80s and early 90s boxing turned into ppv and boxing lost even more fans to soccer, i think we are to see a revival in the next years, what you think of mares and victor ortiz? i think theyll be kicking *** pretty soon....

:lol: I've had the experience of having been in the crosshairs of ALA boxing fans some time back, and I emerged from that one rather well. But I have not had been the prey of Pacfans. Having seen what they can do to websites, no less, I won't beg for it. God forbid that I do it to myself! :lol:

Vicious Victor is already kicking some good ***, as I see it, pal. The first round stoppage of Mausa was beyond words! And that came after his having viciously clobbered Emmanuel Clotey.

His only loss should have been a win. The Alarcon fight was shamefully officiated, I think, and Alarcon himself was just as big a shame.

Along with Ortiz, Abner Mares is also one I'd like to see more of. I realize he does not pack as much power as many others but when his name is mentioned I can't help but visualize his short work of Gabi.

I was among those who were unsettled when they made boxing PPV in Mexico, so I'm so gladdened by your news! :D

Note: sorry for the delays in my responses, bud. This economic s___ that hit the fan is having me doing many things at the same time. :(
mares had detached retina surgery, i think he can easily stay out of circulation for a year, that some serious shyt bro, it almost retired SRL, i have high hopes on ortiz, too bad hes a shortie, i d love to see him clean his and the next division, lets see what happens, time to hit the hay bro, its 2:40 am over here in texas, i hear you on the crisis, myself could end up selling tamales in the streets if the freakin' construction gets no jumpstart from the govt in the next 4 months, canada looks brighter everytime i think about it, ****, even trapping king crabs in alaska or contractor work in iraq :biglaugh:
Mares? Oh, boy!

Anyhow, like you said, let's see what happens...

My wife and I are about to call it a career and we're hoping to move to the Philippines for good. We're going to take advantage of some nifty retirement package they're offering--lots of benefits for expats retiring in PI and the pre-requisites are pretty simple.

Early next year, should be as good a time as we can wish for.

Good luck on whatever move you'll make, pal! We all need tons of good luck! :D

Catchya around here soon!

Author:  jowee [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Austin348 wrote:
jowee wrote:
None of the above.
But here's my top 3.
1. Julio Ceasar Chavez, Sr.
2. Ricardo 'El Finito' Lopez
3. Salvador Sanchez

In that order?

jc chavez sr. as no. 1, followed by el finito, then the great salvador sanchez.

Author:  the-feed.net [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Chavez Sr.

Your list has a few that should not even have been mentioned.

Author:  THE_HIPPIE [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Prancman wrote:
Juan Manuel Marquez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Eric Morales
Jose Julio Chavez Sr.
Oscar Larios
Jorge Solis
Rafael Marquez

Hands down it's Chavez.

Author:  THE_HIPPIE [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

Joe Black wrote:
Prancman wrote:
Juan Manuel Marquez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Eric Morales
Jose Julio Chavez Sr.
Oscar Larios
Jorge Solis
Rafael Marquez


is Jorge Solis a champ?

why Salvador Sánchez is not in the list?

He is a champion, is Mexican title champion.

Author:  THE_HIPPIE [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

grayfist wrote:
Mention of Carlos Zarate always calls to my mind Alfonso Zamora, and the battle of undefeated KO artists. Both are Mexicans.

Prior to that summit, only one fighter went the distance with "Canas" (sorry about the spelling; I don't know how to type the "hispanic n") while Zamora had disposed of all previous opponents before the final bell, including Eusebio Pedroza who later went on to register the most number of sucessful title defenses in the Featherweight class.

In a thread somewhere on this site, I expressed my opinion that The Ring magazine's ranking of Zarate of 70-something in the world's all-time greatest fighters was rather too low. I continue to think so.

Also, talking about Zarate evokes memories of Lupe Pintor and their fight in 79 in Vegas which Pintor won by SD. T'was a classic!

Sadly, Pintor's name is more readily associated with the Johnny Owen tragedy than his sterling accomplishments.

Pintor was Gomez's 17th defense of the SuperBantamweight title (a record which still stands) and that fight is, to understate it, memorable. A round of that encounter, I think, was declared Round of the Year by The Ring.

Personally, I still have to see a SuperBantamweight fight that is as good.

And then there's that other Mexican rivalry: Ruben Olivares and Chuchu Castillo! Olivares beat Lionel Rose while Castillo lost by Split Decision to Rose. Castillo's loss, however, was such a farce that a riot ensued at the Forum, in Inglewood.

Olivares and Castillo met thrice that I can recall with Olivares taking the first and third meetings by UD (but not before being KD'd in the two fights) and Castillo TKO'ing Olivares (due to cuts) in the second fight. All three shouldn't be missed by boxing fans.

I too love all of the three fighters you mentioned. :D

True that the 60's, 70's and early 80's were fantanstic boxing years. The above-mentioned as well as Bazooka Limon's rivalry with Bobby Chacon did a lot to make that so, along with such greats as Lionel Rose, Fighting Harada, Eder Jofre, Vicente Saldivar, Flash Elorde, Ismael Laguna, Sugar Ramos and many, many others.

Edit: As for lyour ast question...I'm neither Mexican nor Filipino. My loss, I guess...:D

Carlos Zarate was kayoed by Daniel Zaragoza who was kayoed by Erik Morales who was kayoed twice by Manny Pacquiao who was kayoed by Oscar Delahoya who kayoed Julio Cesar Chavez twice who kayoed Meldrick Taylor who kayoed......

Author:  Joe Black [ Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who is the greatest mexican boxer?

THE_HIPPIE wrote:
Joe Black wrote:
Prancman wrote:
Juan Manuel Marquez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Eric Morales
Jose Julio Chavez Sr.
Oscar Larios
Jorge Solis
Rafael Marquez


is Jorge Solis a champ?

why Salvador Sánchez is not in the list?

He is a champion, is Mexican title champion.


I can't remember Solis being a Mexican champ... even if he is indeed a mexican champ, being the greatest I believe is to be a "World" champ not a local champ only...

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